Bootle Times News

Posted: **Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:10 pm**

During the May 1941 Blitz I lived at 67 Miranda Road where we received a direct hit by a bomb which failed to explode,.

I recall it was the first house in Liverpool and situated between Olivia and Rosalind Streets but I see from maps on the internet that Rosilind Street seems to have moved from there. Am I mistaken?

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:32 am**

old and new Ernie
bobhamo

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:56 am**

That's great Bob.

Two points of relief.

1. The bomb didn't detonate and
2. I haven't lost my marbles.

You are a gem.

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 12:14 pm**

..are you sure Ernie

Bob to the rescue again.

Sheelagh

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 12:50 pm**

Sure about number 1 and knew the blitz had all but obliterated Rosalind Street around the corner but didn't realise they had actually blown it away completely.

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:40 pm**

1973
bobhamo

Posted: **Wed Nov 14, 2018 4:12 pm**

Thanks Bob.

The last time I saw that debris area was in May 1941 when it was a smouldering pile of rubble of where living neighbours had been just a few hours before. The rubble, burst sewers and gas mains, made the street almost impassable and I cant repeat here the things we found. The smell was overpowering. It was only about a hundred yards from our back yard.

There were never any pictures of the immediate aftermath and later photos will never, ever, show how it was.

Posted: **Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:03 am**

This event just before Christmas 1940 set off a series of events that led to my creation and me writing this now.

Mum aged 15 lived in Malcolm Grove off Marsh Street with her widowed Mother.
Mum's elder Sister Florence lived at 24 Marsh St where her first son Donald was born in 1935
Because Mum was rehoused to a different part of the City she met my Dad at the bus stop there most days and the rest is history as they say.

Posted: **Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:06 am**

Ooops forgot the Map

Posted: **Tue Nov 20, 2018 2:32 pm**

All the streets in Bootle were cobbled and there were always two or three bonfires in every street each November. . Tarmac streets put an end to that.

Also, on looking at the maps of Bootle/Liverpool border (before and after) it shows more than just Rosalind Street has vanished. Braemar Street to name just one.

Looks like the area has been redeveloped from residential to industrial?

Anyone know why this was? Maybe Hitler was responsible?

Posted: **Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:44 am**

Ernie

That area is still residential - they just tweaked the streets a bit as they rebuilt.

As you can see, what was Rosalind Street (bottom half) is now Christmas Street (The old Christmas Street off Brasenose Road has been lost to industry!). The top half now comprises Rosalind Way but doesn't quite follow the line of old Rosalind Street as it veers off to Malcolm Grove instead of running into Christmas Street.

As for Braemar Street, it's still there but very much shortened - it's a cul-de-sac next to the Peacock pub.

Bern

Posted: **Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:20 pm**

Posted: **Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:53 pm**

Hello All,

New member here. I was born in Anfield, but my Dad's family were Bootle born and bred and in particular lived in 10 Rosalind street up until 1935 when my granddad died, and nan and 3 sons (including dad) moved to Anfield. My G Granddad was called "Samuel Rumble" who was a traction engine driver and steam crane operator employed by "Edward Box and sons" who died putting up the bridge across Vauxhall road for Tate and Lyle's in 1924.

I realise this thread is over a year old since the last comment, but just thought I'd mention something that might interest others here for future reference.

With this section being an historical thread I wonder if any of you know of this website.

https://www.old-maps.co.uk/#/Map/337503 ... /13/100871

It allows you to see really VERY good historical maps from all parts of the UK, but the link I've provided is for a 1:500 scale map of Liverpool including Bootle from 1891. If you look down the left hand column you can browse other maps but be aware of the scales.... some are 1:10000 maps which are more decorative than useful. I find the 1950 1:1250 scale map REALLY useful because it even numbers the individual houses. If you want to look at other areas go to the home page and search the "gazeteer", the interface is a little "clunky" but its all good stuff.

On the 1950 map you can see that on Rosalind St from Stanley road to no 41 were torn down after the war due to bomb damage and what looks like prefabs put up in their place. It also looks like the 2 blocks bounded by Stanley rd, Rosalind, Jessica and Celia streets were totally wiped out and prefabs again put in their place. Its quite easy to spot where the smashed houses in the victorian gridiron streets were replaced after the war.

Looking further up in the thread, those bomb reports from "alamo2008" are fantastic, where does he get them from? Love to see more of them.

Cheers for the great site, I'll be looking through these threads for a good while to come.

All the best.

Pete H.

Posted: **Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:13 am**

Bril stuff Pete

Thanks so much for posting and welcome aboard our Bootle Forum.

Bezzies,

Mack (Bootle site admin)

Posted: **Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:52 pm**

Hi Pete welcome

its a good 50s one with the house numbers will save that one

all the liverpool Rumbles 1938 all close to me

if you want ican put the 1938 Rosalind street tenants
bobhamo

Posted: **Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:18 am**

Bob, you are an absolute star, always ready to help

Posted: **Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 pm**

Thanks for the warm welcome all.

Great response, especially the Rumble listings off Bob. Yup you got all my great uncles there, Charlie, who was a motor bike racer of some repute, he used to have a bike shop behind the royal hospital until the 1970s he's long gone but apparently some of his descendents are still in the bike racing scene, and live around Maghull and Ormskirk. George and William were both wagon driver / mechanics. They all lived in Rosalind St until at least the 1920s, Sam himself passed away in 1924 at the time he was living in 54 St John's Rd, opposite St Paul's church..

Can I ask Bob, where did you get those listings you put up? Are they from a Gore's or Kelly's directory? Not sure I've seen them before and do appreciate your time and effort.

I do a bit of family research (only hobby level, but i'm reasonably good) If anyone has any questions, I'll give em a quick coat of "looking over" when I nip on occasionally.

Sam Rumble steam crane at tate & Lyle's ( I know its not Bootle but thought it might be interesting.)

Sam at the docks.

Sam on the Goree piazza 3 of the the young lads are George, Charlie and Willy who Bob listed on his post above.

Sam Rumble.

Hope you find the old maps website useful.

All the best.

Pete

Posted: **Sun Dec 15, 2019 3:16 pm**

Great photos Pete and a bit of history I have a bit more info from the directories 1891 ,1900 have you done your family tree off the mormons site at the moment not to mobile so am only using my iPad I found 2 samuels both engine drivers KEndrick st seaforth and Rosalind st 1900 most of my info sites are on my main computer but will get back to you. Bobhamo

Posted: **Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:21 am**

In answer to Stan's lad question regarding the Air Raid Report and where I obtained it.
That in itself is a weird story of Fate and coincidence.
Having been born at 51 Balliol Rd in 1949 living in Ford till,
I migrated to Brecon with my job in 1977
Sometime in late 2002 a travelling Book Salesman left a supply of books at the Office Reception for the staff to place an order in time for Christmas.
The books varied in subjects from Gardening, Cookery, Children's Books and History.
One Large book was by the Imperial War Museum and was about World War 2 and inside some pages had pouches with inserts of actual I D Cards, Ration Books etc and a Typed Air Raid Report which didn't say where the Air Raid had taken place.
So there's me 62 years after the event that 22 Dec 1940 in my Office 150 miles and 4 hour drive from Liverpool reading this and recognizing the Street Names around Kirkdale station where my 15 year old Mum with her Widowed Mother lived in Malcolm Grove off Marsh Street.
This event of the Germans bombing Mum and Grandma just 3 days before Christmas was about to set off a chain of events that would lead to my creation and subsequently writing this saga.
Mum and Grandma were 2 of the 147 taken to Fazakerley and rehoused.
When I took up Ancestry Research I discovered my Mum's Elder Sister Flo married in 1935 and lived and gave Birth to my Uncle Donald at 47 Marsh Street.
My Mum and Grandma were billetted with an elderly couple in Spooner Ave who had spare rooms.
Grandma visiting her Husbands grave in Bootle Cemetery met a Widower who regularly visited his Late Wife's grave there.
In 1943 they Married each other at the Methodist Hall in School Lane Litherland and Mum moved to their new home in Gardner Ave, Orrell
Mum regularly saw a bloke from Park Lane at the Bus Stop on Watts Lane that she fancied.
She confided that to her new Step Sister who as it happened had been at school with him and so introduced him to Mum at the Walnut Tree during the Blackout in 1944 just before his posting to India.
When he returned in 1947 they married in 1948 at St.Phillips Litherland. and the following year I appeared at 51 Balliol Road

I never did buy that War Annual I just photocopied the Air Raid Report as the part relevant to my Life.

Sadly, my Mum had passed away in 2001 the year before this find in 2002
Showed it to Dad but he couldn't remember about it 5 mins later

Always thought I was in control of my own fate and destiny but when events like this happen it makes you question that logic.

By the way I have now forgiven the Germans for Bombing our Chippies and Mum !

Posted: **Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:03 pm**

Hi, I realise this post is a few years old but wondered if someone could direct me to the location of the original, pre-Blitz Christmas Street. I heard it was off Brasenose Road but was also obliterated by bombs in the Blitz.

Thanks
Stuart

Posted: **Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:21 am**

Welcome Stu

Christmas st

bobhamo

Posted: **Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:40 pm**

ALAMO2008 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:21 am In answer to Stan's lad question regarding the Air Raid Report and where I obtained it.
That in itself is a weird story of Fate and coincidence.
Having been born at 51 Balliol Rd in 1949 living in Ford till,
I migrated to Brecon with my job in 1977
Sometime in late 2002 a travelling Book Salesman left a supply of books at the Office Reception for the staff to place an order in time for Christmas.
The books varied in subjects from Gardening, Cookery, Children's Books and History.
One Large book was by the Imperial War Museum and was about World War 2 and inside some pages had pouches with inserts of actual I D Cards, Ration Books etc and a Typed Air Raid Report which didn't say where the Air Raid had taken place.
So there's me 62 years after the event that 22 Dec 1940 in my Office 150 miles and 4 hour drive from Liverpool reading this and recognizing the Street Names around Kirkdale station where my 15 year old Mum with her Widowed Mother lived in Malcolm Grove off Marsh Street.
This event of the Germans bombing Mum and Grandma just 3 days before Christmas was about to set off a chain of events that would lead to my creation and subsequently writing this saga.
Mum and Grandma were 2 of the 147 taken to Fazakerley and rehoused.
When I took up Ancestry Research I discovered my Mum's Elder Sister Flo married in 1935 and lived and gave Birth to my Uncle Donald at 47 Marsh Street.
My Mum and Grandma were billetted with an elderly couple in Spooner Ave who had spare rooms.
Grandma visiting her Husbands grave in Bootle Cemetery met a Widower who regularly visited his Late Wife's grave there.
In 1943 they Married each other at the Methodist Hall in School Lane Litherland and Mum moved to their new home in Gardner Ave, Orrell
Mum regularly saw a bloke from Park Lane at the Bus Stop on Watts Lane that she fancied.
She confided that to her new Step Sister who as it happened had been at school with him and so introduced him to Mum at the Walnut Tree during the Blackout in 1944 just before his posting to India.
When he returned in 1947 they married in 1948 at St.Phillips Litherland. and the following year I appeared at 51 Balliol Road

I never did buy that War Annual I just photocopied the Air Raid Report as the part relevant to my Life.

Sadly, my Mum had passed away in 2001 the year before this find in 2002
Showed it to Dad but he couldn't remember about it 5 mins later

Always thought I was in control of my own fate and destiny but when events like this happen it makes you question that logic.

By the way I have now forgiven the Germans for Bombing our Chippies and Mum !

Hi ALOMO2008, I have just read your interesting article above, and I am particularly interested in the next to last line.
Certain things happened because of what was happening from 1939 until 1945....World War 2. My Dad who was a
lorry driver for Greenbanks Dairy from Walton Village, joined The Royal Air Force as a Groundcrew driver toward the
end of 1939. Some time in 1940, 307 Squadron was formed, a specialist Nightfighter squadron with the aircrew
pilots and navigators from the Polish Air Force. From early 1941, the Squadron was based at Clyst Honiton airfield
which is now Exeter Airport. Dad was based here with 307 Squadron from early 1941 until 1943. During the summer
of 1941, and because Dad was an experienced lorry driver, he was posted to RAF Colerne, just a few miles to the East
of Bath in Somerset, to teach some of the younger airmen to drive the RAF lorries. He was at Colerne for only 8 weeks,
and during that brief period, he and some of the lads went into Bath city centre occasionally for a few beers, despite
there being a war on. During that 8 weeks, Dad met my Mother, and they were married in January 1942 at St Johns
Church near Walton Vale. In February 1943, our Ken was born, and I popped up in April 1944. If World War 2 had not
happened, then I would not be here typing this post.

Cheers, Ray Smyth.

Posted: **Tue Jan 25, 2022 11:26 am**

and.... further to both of your stories Alan and Ray....
my late father in law, was a young motor mechanic at Ryhope Colliery (Sunderland) when he was called up. He was with the RAF in Egypt when he met his future wife, a Greek girl whose father was managing a hotel in Cairo. So in common with you guys my husband Harry wouldn't be here were it not for WWII.

Posted: **Thu Jun 27, 2024 5:13 pm**

New member here.
My dad lived in 103 Rosalind Street in 1950 'ish
The Ralston's

edit
I have photo of him about 14
Born 1926, so about 1940 outside the house

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